Anything worth talking about, is worth blogging about

Canada has now reported a case of swine flu resistant to oseltamivir (Tamiflu). This raises an interesting question for the people this post is addressed to. Since, according to you, evolution does not happen, swine flu is not becoming resistant to Tamiflu. Hence, if you are infected with it, you will never need any alternatives. Even if your life depended on getting those alternatives, you would never use them because Tamiflu would always work. If you act otherwise, then you’ve just shown that there are no creationists in foxholes.


Comments on: "A message for creationists, intelligent design advocates, and cdesign proponentsists" (8)

  1. Your not this ignorant right? This is has to be a joke.

    But to play along with your joke, how does a flu strain becoming resistant to a drug prove evolution happens? You may want to state your definition of evolution.

  2. Evolution is simply a change in allele frequencies from one generation to another.

    This Medline Abstract mentions the beneficial (for the virus) mutation that causes resistance to Tamiflu. Another Medline abstract indicates that someone was treated with Tamiflu, with “[o]seltamivir-resistant viruses were first detected at day 4 of treatment and on each successive day of the study.” Since resistant viruses were only detected later, this shows that the frequency of alleles changed, which is exactly what evolution is.

    In addition, natural selection has been detected in influenza viruses.

  3. Ok, then as a “creationists” (as you would label me) I agree that this is evidence that the virus has changed so that it can resist medication. If that is the definition of the word evolution as used in this instance we agree.

    The danger is exstrapolating this out to say that this is evidence for macro-evolution and that the swine flu virus and homo sapiens are descended from a common ancestor, which clearly it does not.

    So I don’t see where any creationist or ID supporter would have a problem with using different medication to fight off a virus that has developed an immunity to a drug. Besides most viruses, such as Hiv and malaria, develop resistance to medications by loosing the part of their genetic string that is effected, so technically they de-evolve to protect themselves.

  4. I know this is a bit late of a response.

    Macroevolution is simply microevolution on a large scale; see here for an analogy describing the difference.

  5. Rob, that analogy does not work because there are biological limits built into our DNA, there are no limits on compound interest.

    Can you show one example where a fish became a non-fish? or any creature spawning a different type of creature? I am trying to keep the terms general to give you a chance.

    And, so that we are working with the same definitions:

    Micro-evolution: “House sparrows have adapted to the climate of North America, mosquitoes have evolved in response to global warming, and insects have evolved resistance to our pesticides. These are all examples of microevolution—evolution on a small scale.” source:

    Macro-Evolution: “In evolutionary biology today, macroevolution is used to refer to any evolutionary change at or above the level of species. It means at least the splitting of a species into two (speciation, or cladogenesis, from the Greek meaning “the origin of a branch”) or the change of a species over time into another (anagenetic speciation, not nowadays generally accepted).”

  6. Can’t you just quote the part that convinces you of macro-evolution? There is a lot to read there. Oh well, I will give it a read and get back to you on this one.

  7. Its easy guys. Just accept the fact that you Both do not have the answers. If either of you did, the fight would be over.

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